Escape to the suburbs! Jason Hartman and Evan Moffic discuss the upcoming outbound urban migration into suburban areas. With the work from home and learn from home environments people are looking for large spaces outside of high-density, urban environments.
Jason Hartman 00:02
Welcome to the creating wealth show with Jason Hartman. You’re about to learn a new slant on investing some exciting techniques and fresh new approaches to the world’s most historically proven asset class that will enable you to create more wealth and freedom than you ever thought possible. Jason is a genuine self made multi millionaire who’s actually been there and done it. He’s a successful investor, lender, developer and entrepreneur who’s owned properties in 11 states had hundreds of tenants and been involved in thousands of real estate transactions. This program will help you follow in Jason’s footsteps on the road to your financial independence day. You really can do it on now. here’s your host, Jason Hartman with the complete solution for real estate investors.
Jason Hartman 00:54
Welcome to Episode 1461 1004 161 approaching Episode 1500 coming up soon. We are 39 episodes away, right? Hey. So today I’ve got a great interview with our client turned investment counselor, and that is Rabbi Evan malefic. So he’s coming up here in a moment. But before we get to that, I thought I would share a quote that I thought was a pretty good quote. And it is about one of my favorite topics that we have talked about so many times over the years and so many times at our live events, and that is the topic of inflation, inflation. Okay, so here we go. It’s pretty good quote, inflation is a disease of money. Thus, inflation may have become the oldest form of government finance. It may also have been the oldest form of political confidence game used by leaders to extract tribute from constituents. Older even then taxes and inflation has kept those honored places in human affairs to this day. for 4000 years of recorded history, man has known inflation. Jen’s Parson, the book dying of money. Isn’t that a great quote? Think about it 4000 years. That’s how long we’ve known inflation. Remember in the the old days a zillion years ago, shortly after the invention of money, what people would do is they would take their gold and silver coins and they would literally shave the outer portion of the coin off and then they would use that golden silver and melted down and Make more that they could trade, right? They would literally shave some of the coin off. And that was essentially a form of inflation. And then in the game of money, and I’ve studied this, but it was so many years ago, I can’t even remember the details. But there were, there was a time in history when people got tired of carrying all their precious metals around, right. So they’d carry their silver, their gold, they have a little pouch, and they carried in and then they trade with it and so forth. And, and so what did they do? Well, it was the modern it was the not the modern version, but it was the, the ancient version of fiat money was created back then, where someone basically created a vault system, and they would say, okay, you can deposit your gold and silver coins with us, and we will give you a receipt and that receipt those receipts then, because there were so many that were generated, actually became a form of currency of fiat currency. And people would, instead of going back to the vault to the depository, aka Bank of sorts, they would just trade the receipts. You know, why do you need the actual gold and the silver coins when you you have a receipt and this receipt says I have so much in the in the depository, and so just accept my receipt and pay that was fiat money in essence, right. So yeah, it’s pretty interesting. Pretty interesting. You know, the first coins were fashioned in Asia Minor. And I can’t remember how long ago that was, but it was a long, doggone time ago. And yeah, humans have known inflation for for millennia. Can you believe that? It’s amazing. It’s older than taxation. So pretty interesting stuff. Remember, you Inflation is a robber in a thief. But it is something that you because you were lucky enough. And I was lucky enough for you to discover my podcast maybe many, many years ago, not 4000 years ago, but many years ago. And since then, I have shared with you my radical ideas on how you can benefit from inflation, how you can gain the system. I have been very honored to be your guide and doing this to help you align your interest with the most powerful forces the human race has ever known governments and central banks that are screwing the vast majority of the human race, but you are benefiting from it because you know how to invest right? And you know how to use debt in a prudent manner. And you know how to benefit from it will keep guiding you through that process as time goes on, and boy times they are changing. That’s for So So we’re here for you reach out to us one 800 Hartman or Jason Hartman, calm. And without further ado, let’s get to a talk that I did with Evan recently. And I think you’ll find this interesting because we discuss a variety of topics. So here we go. Hey, I want to welcome Evan back to the show. He hasn’t been on for a little while. And as you know, he is an investment counselor if you need him, you can reach out through our website or at one 800 Hartman. And Evan, we got a few things to talk about. We’ve been putting news into our private group. Of course, the venture Alliance members have access to this and and the Jay Chou members have access to some of this because we put some of these articles in there. So you may be familiar but the New York Times is only two months behind my prediction and they are reporting that Corona virus escape to to the suburbs, the pandemic has convinced some new yorkers that it’s time to finally give up on city living, give up on city living. You know, folks, I’ve said it and I’m gonna stand by this one. I think the world has changed for ever. I am not even making a commentary on how grave a threat or how not grave a threat Coronavirus may or may not be, or whether it’s a big conspiracy, but there’s no question. People’s psychology has changed. The economy has been damaged immensely from this. And things are reacting to that alone. So you don’t have to have anything else besides those things. And they’re just facts. So Evan, this article, a big piece in The New York Times, let’s let’s dive in. Talk to us about this about
Evan Moffic 07:52
well, it cited a lot of reasons. I mean, we’ve been we were talking about people leaving the big cities even for the last two years before the Coronavirus for a variety of reasons, price safety, so forth. But now it’s accelerating even more. And this article what I thought was really interesting is it pointed out things I hadn’t thought of like in urban university. So one of the things that brought new york so much back to life in the 90s was the rise of NYU, and other cities like Boston, Boston University, universities are hit so hard by COVID-19, that they’re not going to be able to have these huge lecture halls. So another reason they cities did so well has been lost, and people want space they want to cocoon. I mean, you’ve been talking about this for a while. But this idea of cocooning and being in a safe open environment is even more appealing now.
Jason Hartman 08:42
Yeah, you’re absolutely right. You know, back in the 90s, I read faith popcorns book. I’d love to get faith popcorn on the show. We have not interviewed her yet. As you all may know, I’m a big fan of futurists. I read a lot of futurist material. Alvin Toffler. I have to talks about the late Alvin Toffler faith popcorn, john Nesbitt, mega trends, etc, etc. Many there are many others of course, and faith popcorn talked about it in the 90s. She talked about the idea of cocooning. She may have coined that term. And it was it was just based on the idea that people are cocooning in their house, their home is their castle, and back then the great technology that was making that all possible was home theater systems. Okay. Favorite big premise was, Why do people need to go to the movie theater anymore? You know, of course he was right at the time. That was a big thing, but it’s nothing compared to what we have at home nowadays. So listeners, you know, this is not just about real estate investing. When we talk about this. It’s about a variety of things. If you are in a business or industry that sells things for the home, if you are in the home improvement business, if you’re a contractor You know, these industries I think will flourish in the coming years because people are really, you know, they’re just kind of cocooning, and they’re making their homes better. And I’m doing that, you know, I’ve noticed this behavior in myself, like I’ve said before, and I don’t want to sound insensitive to people because I know this is very hard on a lot of people, but I personally have really been enjoying my staycation. Okay. And I am getting a lot done at home. I like it. Okay, I don’t want it to be this way forever. Admittedly, cabin fever is it’s coming. But the right now, I’ve been liking it. And so you know, I’ve been buying more home related things. I bought a new piece of furniture. You know, I’ve been buying some more stuff. I’ve been like kind of doing my little minor amount of home improvement. And I think for other people, this will be much more significant than it is for me, and businesses will make money off of this. Businesses that sell home improvement, remodels, additions, you know, the real estate industry. You know, in terms of traditional home sales, when it gets going again and it is going, but it’s going to go a lot more people are going to look for larger homes, more comfortable homes, places where they can really cocoon where they have space for home gym equipment home office. And, you know, if it’s a family, it’s multiple home offices, because each spouse needs a place to work, potentially. And each kid needs a place to work to, because there’s going to be a big uptick in homeschooling, there’s going to be home universities, we’re discovering that the Emperor called the college, the government, university debt enslavement complex, how that emperor has no clothes people can learn at home. And like you said, Evan, the cities I mean, think about it, Boston within a short distance of the core of Boston, you have 35 universities, colleges and universities, okay. And that has driven to a large extent, the real estate us there that has made Boston a very attractive city. And like you said about New York, same deal. This stuff is no longer the big draw. It’s not that meaningful, people are going to learn remotely. And we’re going to fortunately see a lot of these universities go bust as their enrollments decline, thankfully, as they should. And as we see more scalable online learning, that should be almost free. You don’t make college free the way idiots like Bernie Sanders want to Okay, you may call it free by using technology that has been available for really two decades now.
Evan Moffic 12:39
Okay, and I let you go, can I can I let you go on a short tangent here, too. I thought
Jason Hartman 12:43
I was on a tangent. But you know, I just I’m just saying these universities, and I’m noticing that with my own kids schools, and with summer camps, there is just a total lack of creativity. And I’ve kind of noticed, especially with the nonprofit like I’ve been Notice with nonprofit camps for for profit camps, the nonprofit camps were the first ones to cancel. The for profit camps are figuring out ways to deliver value to their camps to their students. I bet with universities, this has really been this industrial complex that use the power of government to control things. We this may be an opportunity for great schools to figure out creative ways to engage students and parents. Absolutely, absolutely. And you know, gyms are doing that, too. You know, there’s this beautiful new gym near my house, it was open for a very short time, then it had to close down. And, you know, through their app, they have homework out suggestions and stuff, you know, they’re really trying to maintain that relationship with their customers. And you’re absolutely right. Listen, you know, when people don’t have an incentive, when they’re not paid for results. Why should they be creative? You know, why? Why should they be the human? Won’t, you know, look Our brain uses about 20% of the entire energy budget of our body. Okay? Its brain is a hog. It’s a really big processor. And it uses a lot of power. It uses 20% of the body’s power, which is a lot for something that doesn’t even move. Okay? You know compared to all your muscles and your legs and you know all that stuff, right? So we try to be cognitive misers. And having you know, you and I have been studying this a bit lately when we discover when we’ve been studying advertising and copywriting. Yeah, story, storytelling. You got to make it easy for people. And yes, when you want to deliver a marketing message, that’s what I mean. But on the converse of that, is, like you said, Look, the nonprofits, the big fat professors at the universities that are tenured, they’re not going to try hard. The nonprofit’s are not going to try hard because they don’t get paid to try hard. They’re not At stake
Evan Moffic 15:00
you once in a while you once in a while find an exception. Yes, sure. Extraordinary teachers, but in general, right, I’ve just noticed that one camp we’re looking at for our kids like then all these other camps closed and one of them. I saw on the website, they’re outlining everything they’re doing to make the camp safe. They are going above and beyond and I know they’re going to be telling me they are adapting. They’re doing what they have to do.
Jason Hartman 15:24
Yeah, absolutely. Okay, looking at this article a little bit before we move on to the next topic. Okay. I found this to be interesting. Okay. People are packing their bags between March 15. And April 28. moves from New York to Connecticut, increased by 74%. From one year ago, okay, that’s according to a company called flat rate moving and by the way, these moving reports are available and I teach that in my creating wealth seminar, to learn about migration trends and so forth. And, you know, there’s pro movement. org and u haul U haul is actually a very good website, they really do some nice surveys on this kind of stuff. And in suburban towns, which are not really known for their rental stock, meaning rental stock of homes had huge spikes in activity, which is being driven in part by escaping New Yorkers, according to brokers in these areas. Now, this is the new york times article that i’m i’m quoting from here. Okay, leafy, Wilton. Is that a person leafy? Welcome.
Evan Moffic 16:32
Wilton, Connecticut, right. Oh, okay. Yes.
Jason Hartman 16:35
Okay, sorry. What do I know? geography northeast geography. We don’t sell much up there. So I don’t know if it’s okay. Excuse me, for my neck,
Evan Moffic 16:45
not good rent to value ratios.
Jason Hartman 16:47
No, definitely not. For instance, experienced 19 lease signings between March 1 and April 29 versus 10 in the same period a year ago. So that’s a 40% increase. Okay. What else do you want to share from this thing? How about was Connecticut? That’s amazing. Okay, in the same area of Westport, nice head sickness board, Martha Stewart lands it with her ankle bracelet. Had 63 new rentals up from 36. Okay, one year earlier, earlier go while Greenwich, Connecticut was at 200 versus 158. Properties included single family houses and condos and leases were sometimes as short as two months,
Evan Moffic 17:33
fast that people are turning their homes into short term rentals in some
Jason Hartman 17:36
ways. I mean, they’re not the same, like you were saying about your Airbnb, short term rental that you bought through our network. Not it’s not as short is the typical way we think of, you know, rented for a week or three days, you know, but this is like a two month rental. Yeah, right. Right.
Evan Moffic 17:54
It is it’s nice and you know, this also proves something you were saying a couple years ago about Renting has lost its stigma. You know? I mean, yes, people are kind of forced to rent here. But no one cares about No, no one cares whether you’re a renter or not in, in most neighborhoods out in Westport, Connecticut, if someone’s paying $20,000 a month to rent a house, nobody on the street is going to say, Oh, these renters are bringing down the value of our homes. That’s not happening. And
Jason Hartman 18:18
yeah, no, that’s, that’s totally changed. I mean, in all admit, even myself, you know, back in the 90s, I used to look down my own nose at renters and think, Well, you know, like, your age, shouldn’t you own a house by now, you know, I really thought, you know, Hey, sorry, you know, that’s the way the world thought back then. You know, it’s like, if you didn’t buy your own place, by the time you were 30 or 35, you were kind of a loser. You know, that was, that’s the way we used to think. But now, you know, renting has totally lost a stigma. Listen, I would rather be renting myself right now. Okay. And I own lots of rentals that I rent other people. Renting is a better deal, the more expensive Home a better deal is even 55,000 a month with that one in the Hamptons that you posted. Right?
Evan Moffic 19:06
Yeah, the with the infinity pool. Sounds like a nice. I wonder how much they you know, I wonder what the rent to value ratio and a house a house like that it’s gotta be horrible. Well,
Jason Hartman 19:16
yeah, that house has got to be worth a lot more than 5.5 million. Right. So 55,000 would be 1%. Right?
Evan Moffic 19:23
I guess that’s true. I guess that is a good rent.
Jason Hartman 19:27
It’s a bad rent value, because I’m sure that house is probably $15 million or more. Right, right. Right. You know, we could be it could be 50 million for all I know, right? So they really should sell the house and buy some properties in Indianapolis and live our little rock. Well, if their houses worth if their house is worth 20 million, they could sell that house and buy 200 rentals or network. You just go to Jason hartman.com slash properties and they could be happy to and they could have $1,000 times 200 they can have $200,000 a month approximately versus 55,000 a month because their rent to value ratio sucks.
Evan Moffic 20:05
Yeah. Much more efficient use of capital. Definitely no question about it, folks. Shameless self promotion. Go find that go find those deals at Jason urban calm. All right. Okay. Anything else on this topic before we switch gears? No, this is I mean, this is just something you’ve been talking about for a while. It’s not gonna end it’s in it. It’s not just Coronavirus. This is many other factors. Yeah, pushing this and as you always say, put yourself on the same side as the most important, you know, institutions like the government and the Federal Reserve will also put yourself on the side of demographic changes and big demographic change.
Jason Hartman 20:42
Absolutely. Absolutely. So speaking of these changes, homebuilders have seen sales jump as renters flee small urban apartments. Now, this is Diana olek, one of my favorites, CNBC, and the article is entitled exactly that is what I’ve been saying for two months. homebuilders suddenly see sales jump, as renters flee small urban apartments. So they’re getting out of the urban areas with these tiny little places. It’s not very comfortable to cocoon, in a tiny little urban apartment or condo. And they’re moving to the burbs, you know, it’s the same thing. The New York Times article, it says, it says in the initial four weeks of the national shutdown, sales of newly built homes began falling. They were down 85% from the normal spring activity by the fourth week. Now, of course, the traditional home shoppers, they weren’t leaving, you know, nobody was having any open houses. Nobody was showing property. So of course, they’re down. But listen to this in the past two weeks, however, the numbers have started to climb according to and we’ve had him on the show a few times, john Byrne’s real estate consulting, which tracks hundreds of builders nationwide. We’re still down roughly 65% but more positive news. Coming out of the new home market particularly for builders, says Devin Bachman manager at JB RC I just got an email from Gavin. So this is interesting. And as these lockdowns lift, and people get less concerned, there is going to be a mass like this is. This is the 2020 version of The Grapes of Wrath. Okay is a john Steinbeck famous book, The Grapes of Wrath was about migration. Now, they’re not all going to the same place this time. So it’s different in that sense. But they are going to a diverse set of places that have one thing in common. They’re suburban. They’re places where people can socially distance and where they can get a much larger home where they can feel comfortable in at home.
Evan Moffic 22:50
Do you think Jason, that there’s going to be any switch to know how you’ve had the author of the book state of the states on there? Where she down yeah, married Whitney, you know, I’m in Illinois. So we are, I think the second or third strictest state. And I’m worried that schools won’t even open in the fall. And obviously, you know, I’m here I’m not moving anywhere anytime soon. But if I had the freedom, why wouldn’t I move to like a state where there’s just, you know, first of all that better weather Aside from that, but where you can, you can have more opportunities. Were there more businesses that are opening up where there’s just, I feel some time now, again, this will depend on people’s own individual feelings about Coronavirus, but I’m eager to get back to work to get out again. You think some some overbearing governments will drive people out of their states? Yeah. Well, you know, I’d be remiss if I didn’t, if we didn’t talk about Elon Musk. So Elon Musk has been making noise that he’s going to move Tesla and he got a response I’m looking at our article says lawmakers response to Musk is brief. And to the point some point out That it’s harder to dismiss job the jobs Tesla provides. Okay. Ilan Musk has threatened to move Tesla out of California, and one lawmaker seems ready to move on without him leaving little room for ongoing debate. Lorena Gonzalez tweeted late Saturday F. Ilan musk fsck Okay.
Jason Hartman 24:25
The CEO is unhappy with California’s restrictions. It’s it’s just amazing that she would say that that she would actually tweet the F word to Ilan musk. And you know, that’s the attitude of California. You know, listen, I’m, I’m no big Ilan musk fan. Okay. No, I definitely will criticize him until the cows come home. But, you know, in this battle, I’m on his side. Because these politicians they are just, they’re just pathetic in California. They’re awful. They are so unwelcoming to business. They’re trying It’s like a state that is trying to commit suicide it’s absolutely unbelievable I
Evan Moffic 25:04
mean these are good paying jobs I mean I can’t you i was i was listening to a story about Ilan musk too and talked about how you know he’s he has he has he has so much money and get his employees that are on furlough don’t know when they’re going to be hired back. They’re not making any money and it was just a sad story and I I sympathize, of course with his employees, but these are generally higher paying jobs. So if California doesn’t want them, he’s gonna go open up another factory in Reno. Yeah.
Jason Hartman 25:30
A lot of those people will just move right they’ll drive to Reno or whatever right. It says now here’s what they say in the article goes on and goes. Ilan needs California, then more than California needs. Ilan. What are you kidding me? I doubt that. Okay. Another Post said, Tesla has a lot of employees in the state. So what you’re actually saying you meaning you the government is F 37,000 And people and their families. That’s exactly what the Socialist Republic of California is saying. absolutely stupid. And folks, every time some idiot in New York or California pulls something like that some idiot politician, it just benefits the type of real estate that you can find at Jason hartman.com. So I’ll just point that out again. Okay with these homebuilders. I just wanted to play for you a little clip here that talks about the mortgage market and this issue. So let’s just get this and then we’ll wrap it up
Evan Moffic 26:37
pretty well now by mortgages then go into the government’s forbearance program after they close that program allows borrowers to delay their payments for up to a year if they’ve been impacted by the economic shutdown. Now, Fannie and Freddie hadn’t been buying those loans, leaving lenders on the hook, and as a result, lending tightens dramatically. You can see here
Jason Hartman 26:56
see basically what they’re doing is fancy Mae and Freddie Mac are now acting in a dysfunctional manner to bail out the system. This wouldn’t happen if these weren’t government sponsored entities. Okay? It only happens because of this. It’s dysfunctional. Nobody in the free market would do it, but they’re doing it. So go on
Evan Moffic 27:22
how mortgage credit availability tanked in March. Now, there are a lot of factors behind that, but this was just one of them. Fannie and Freddie’s regulator said in a statement, purchases of these previously ineligible loans will help provide liquidity to mortgage markets and allow originators to keep lending not from Mark Calabria. Now, there are certain limits of course,
Jason Hartman 27:42
of course it will, of course, of course, it’ll help the mortgage market but it just goes to show you that they’re just bailing out every aspect of the system everywhere you look.
Evan Moffic 27:52
Oh, you must have closed between February 1 and may 31 of this year. It can be to buy a home or revive but no cash out refinance alone cannot be more than 30 days delinquent. There will also be a cop premium for lenders to sell these 5% of the loan for first time homebuyers and 7% for repeat homebuyers. There is some disagreement as to what this means for mortgage rates. Some say they could fall slightly as the credit box opens up more. Others say some lenders will pass on those higher costs onto borrowers in the form of higher rates.
Jason Hartman 28:25
So that’s Diana olek, at CNBC, and there you go. It’s bailouts everywhere we look, Kevin.
Evan Moffic 28:32
But Jason, this is this is I’ve been wanting to ask you this question. How is this just going to last forever? I mean, I’m sure that the fact that all these bailouts are delaying foreclosures and the ability for let’s say, our local market specialists to find great deals, is that are they just delaying it by three months or six months? Or is this just going to continue to happen for years on end will?
Jason Hartman 28:55
I guess every bailout in essence delays the inevitable Which is the collapse of the system eventually. But the difference between my thinking and all of the chicken littles like Peter Schiff, and Jamie, Jim Rickards, and just everybody, they’re all out there saying the economy is going to collapse, right? They’ve been saying this for decades are always wrong. The reason is because nobody knows how long they can keep kicking the can down the road. And I say they can kick this can down the road another 50 100 years. And right, the question is compared to what can you know, yeah, it’s all it’s all dysfunctional, but it’s dysfunctional everywhere. It’s not just in the US, it’s the whole
Evan Moffic 29:38
next why market timing doesn’t really work with our, with our approach, because we are we’re buying for cash flow, and it Okay, so maybe it’ll be cheaper in a year but you’re still gonna be collecting cash all
Jason Hartman 29:53
Yeah. And you know, probably the kind of houses we recommend. They’re probably not going to be cheaper. I mean, we may see A huge decline in real estate prices. But when you segment that up by market linear cyclical hybrid, and then you you segment by price and you segment by high rise condo versus suburban, single family home, and when you do all of that, I think you might see the real dollar prices of our properties go up, or at least remain stable in this now, maybe not maybe the economic collapse will be so bad that everything will go down, but then it will kill the buying market and strengthen the rental market. So as I teach in the three dimensions of real estate, as I call it, that strategy of mine that I’ve been teaching for 16 years, the rents the rental market and the purchase market are non correlating. Okay, so when people are forced to stay in the renter pool because housing affordability has gone down And that goes not by the price but by the payment. Okay? So the interest rates are up, right and we’re in bad times or if people don’t view the future, as though the market will appreciate in value. They don’t buy it. They just wait. You know, it’s it’s like it’s like deflation versus inflation, Evan, look, if you’re if your currency is going down in value, you try to spend it as quickly as possible in an inflationary environment. Because you want to buy your stuff you want to exchange your currency for your dollars for stuff when before the stuff gets more expensive,
Evan Moffic 31:38
right actually assets
Jason Hartman 31:39
Yeah, so yeah, especially assets but even just goods that you need, you know, a sofa, whatever, right. But in in, in a deflationary environment, you do the opposite. You get off you wait, you say hey, look, it’s gonna be cheaper later. I’m not going to buy now. I’m just going to keep renting because I’m going to wait for the prices to go down. Okay. Good luck with that. We’ll take the 20% yield you give us every year, and you keep running fine. No problem
Evan Moffic 32:06
I like it. Me too. Me too. It’s a plan that works. And it’s really, really see what happens here really is Evan,
Jason Hartman 32:13
wrap it up with any any other thoughts you have?
Evan Moffic 32:17
Well, I think we just showed that real estate income property, especially our approach income property is the most durable asset class. It’s not, it’s not going to double your money in six months, but it will build long term wealth in almost any market environment. And we just don’t know we don’t know what the future holds. And don’t you want something that has proven returns through all of history? And that’s what we have,
Jason Hartman 32:41
you know, one of the, my very favorite phrases, and it’s from one of the classics, okay? Is the book starts off by saying, I am ready to be the hero of my own life. And that’s what I want to say to all of the listeners. You are the hero Have this story, Evan, and I and the rest of our team, we’re here to be your guide, and to help you have a heroic life. And that’s really what this is about. So you’re the hero. We’re the guide. We’re here to help you along the way and give you the guidance you need. So you can build an awesome real estate portfolio so you can get at in state of financial security in a world where the opposite is happening to most people. So fortunately, you found us, you’ve been listening to the show, and we will guide you guide you through these turbulent times. But there’s a lot of opportunity in these turbulent times. All right, Evan. Hey, thank you
Evan Moffic 33:40
so much for joining us today. Thanks, Jason. Thanks for having me.
Jason Hartman 33:44
Until next time, everybody, happy investing. Thank you so much for listening. Please be sure to subscribe so that you don’t miss any episodes, be sure to check out the show’s specific website. And our General website Hartman Mediacom for appropriate disclaimers and Terms of Service. Remember that guest opinions are their own. And if you require specific legal or tax advice or advice and any other specialized area, please consult an appropriate professional. And we also very much appreciate you reviewing the show. Please go to iTunes or Stitcher Radio or whatever platform you’re using and write a review for the show we would very much appreciate that. And be sure to make it official and subscribe so you do not miss any episodes. We look forward to seeing you on the next episode.